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Friday, December 22, 2006

Moneyless World - A Reality Or An Ideology?

I’m at a posh house-sit now, till Jan. 31st, sharing it with my friend, Phil. I haven’t spent much time in the canyon this winter. I also have a new secret squat in town, which Phil coined “the squattage.”

Wal-Mart Schmalfart
Wal-Mart wants to build in the Moab area. Many folks are saying it’s inevitable, that there’s nothing we can do but throw up our hands. Many say that if Moab's Grand County doesn’t welcome Wal-Mart, neighboring San Juan County will, and Grand County will lose both a tax base and its businesses. Never mind that both San Juan County and this county will lose most their small businesses and most the money will flow out of the area. This is Wal-Mart’s common tactic, pitting counties against each other, then leaching them all.
The no-end-in-sight growth of the capitalistic cancer seems unstoppable, omnipotent. A few people have commented to me that my visions of a moneyless world are naïve & idealistic. I often think so, too.

Am I Naïve? Am I a Realist?

But now I put out this question: is my life being driven by ideology or reality? What I know and can only know is what’s in my self, what brings me unspeakable peace. And that peace is Reality, because I know it. If this were only a belief and not knowledge, it would be just an Ideology.

Yes, today I’ve had an epiphany about the Real and the Ideal.

Real is what is. Ideal is thoughts about what was, will be, or could or should be or have been. When Ideal becomes what IS, thoughts become crucified, and the Ideal resurrects as the Real. The ideal and the real merge as One, even as bread merges with the body when eaten.
Somebody told me I should have a plan for this envisioned moneyless world. But there can be no plans in any brain on how a moneyless society could function. If there could be, it wouldn’t be moneyless. It can only function by giving up mind-control and resting in simple faith, in trust. Everyone who truly follows their own religion will know exactly what I am saying. Money by its very nature is mind control. This is where I am called naïve. Indeed I am.

How can we trust people if we can't give up control of them? Every parent learns that an untrusted child becomes untrustworthy. Trust can only be born from trust, even if you have to forgive the untrustworthy 70 x 7 times.

And why, in its Grand Sense of Humor, has the Universe spread religion by the hands of money-worshipers to every corner of this world – religion that at its very core spells out the principles of a moneyless world? What a hoot. I’m not just talking about the money-worshipping Christian institution, but all the world religions. At their core is the key! I've even recently been astonished to realize this key at the core of Mormonism! The Book of Mormon is the most ingeniously absurd book I've ever read, and Joseph Smith the divine comedian.

I've spoken my ideology. And can you see this ideology dissolving into Reality, which cannot be spoken?

Can you see behind my ideas that I am a Realist? I have often held that if every person became real, balance would automatically return as it is in the wild, natural world. (Yet, we can never return to animal nature, but a likeness of it, with new, uniquely human awareness. How do I know this? Practice the core path of your religion and you’ll see for yourself).

If every person became real, money would cease. You can't make money cease with Reality following. You must first become Real, and then money ceases as Reality comes. Why do I say this? Listen, because it’s so simple it may astonish you:
Prostitution: Real or Illusion?
Let’s take a look at prostitution again. You pay a prostitute to “make love” to you. You know the act is not real, you know that neither you nor the prostitute is being real. You’re paying for illusion. It’s artificial love. The “love” is an idea, not a reality. We all know deep down that we can only love and be loved out of purely free will – spontaneous, free, unpaid for. Love cannot exist any other way. If it is not free it is not real.

If you stop paying the prostitute, that isn't going to make her love you, either. You must first love her and she must first love you, so that the idea of you paying her becomes totally revolting. This is why I am not for the abolishment of money. Money is not the evil, it is our not being Real, illusion, that is evil.
I am not for the abolishment of money, but I am for money going obsolete. Money cannot be abolished, but money can go obsolete, vanish, if we simply be real. Why? Because money itself is not real, but only a belief, an illusion.

Ponder this: Nothing Real is evil. Nothing that Exists is evil. Nobody who is real is evil. Nobody who Exists is evil! Only illusions and actors can be evil.

Now extend this principle of prostitution to every particle in the universe. Do you let things (anything !) come your way naturally, freely, spontaneously, or do you have to pay to make what you want happen? Do you trust that everything you need comes your way in its own good time, or do you lose patience and pay for it to come in your own controlled time? Do you trust or do you bribe? Do you think the only way you can get what you need is to pay for it, to go in debt to get it? Or do you think the only way you can "get it" is to rape? If this is the only way to survive, then love is a myth and there is no reality.

Why does love forever elude you?

“Love is patient”. If you lose patience and think the only way you can get what you need is to pay for it, to manipulate it, then love forever eludes you, reality forever eludes you, and the universe to you becomes impersonal and meaningless. You prowl the dark streets for prostituted love, forever chasing desire never fulfilled. You become the cynic, and your beliefs in the universe are self-fulfilling. All occurrences and people become untrustworthy in your self-fulfilling prophecy. And your ego gloats, saying, "See, I was right, and you and your naive spirituality were wrong." And indeed you were right. Your belief has created your "reality." Anybody who has recovered from clinical depression knows this principle.

Neither you nor the prostitute can be real. Neither you nor anything you pay for can be real!

Again, Why Do I Live Moneyless?

Why do I live moneyless? Because I have no more strength for the world of artificiality, no more strength for the world of ideology separate from reality! Why should I want to return to clinical depression? Yes, I am a realist! All I want is the real and to be real. It takes work to hold up a prop, an act. It is Rest to be Real.

Instead of using the misused and twisted word, “God”, I am now using the word Reality. Hear Oh Humanity: the Reality your Lord is One. You shall love Reality with all of your heart, all of your soul, all of your mind, and all of your strength. And the second commandment is like it: You shall love your Neighbor as your own Self. There is NOTHING but Reality. Ponder that. How can I love my neighbor if I can’t recognize my neighbor as Real, and how can I recognize my neighbor as Real if I am not Real? Become Real: This is our only mission in life. As the old Sting song says, “Be your self, no matter what they say.” The one who is ashamed of being Real will be shamed before all creatures, no matter how many props he hides himself under.

Become Real, become Reality.

Impersonal To the Impersonal. Personal To the Personal.

We think of the universe as impersonal. We are persons, part of the Universe, aren’t we? Isn’t the definition of person a being with Free Will? Does the universe have free will? We exist, don’t we; and we are part of the Universe, aren’t we? And isn’t the only Real person the person who doesn’t have to be paid to act, coerced to act? And isn’t the only Love the need that comes in its own sweet time for free, un-coerced, unpaid for? When we become Real, the whole universe becomes Real. “To the Pure all is Pure.” Thus, Real is synonymous with Love. And Love is Personality. There can be nothing Real apart from Love, and there can be no Love apart from the Real. And Love can only be given and taken freely, else it is not Love! In other words, the Real can only be given and taken freely else it is not Real!

Real means “Royal” in Spanish.

Do you believe in Reality? So, skeptic, are you really the realist you think you are?

The Beauty of the Mythic Image

Now the beauty of Reality is that Reality clothes itself in myth, in illusion, as a mythic king is garbed in splendor. And Reality rides on Myth as Vishnu rides on the Seven-Headed Naga raft, and as the Seven-Headed Naga snake shelters the Buddha in his liberation, and as Aztec Quetzal-Coatl (Mayan Kulkulkan) floats away on his Serpent Raft. When we recognize the Myth as myth, the Illusion as illusion, the Actor as actor, the Prop as prop, all neither good nor evil, then the World becomes a Play, as Shakespeare says. It becomes a Play of One Real with many masks.
Then Mammon voluntarily serves us, we no longer serve Mammon. And Mammon is no longer evil for us, because we no longer possess it. Obligation (Debt) ceases and Love eternally begins. Love always eternally begins.


Ah, the words of a naïve, silly idealist, Silly Realist. Silly Sally Stopped Selling Seashells Sitting at the Seashore and lived happily ever after.

82 comments:

  1. So you drift through life like some kind of stray dog, living of the scraps of the rest of us that actually have some sort of self worth and pride on supporting ourselves through life? The food you live on? Either scraps and remnants of a meal someone actually paid for, or maybe a meal you con off some weakminded individual that actually buys into your delusions. The computers you use, the homes you stay in...those are all paid for by someone, are provided to you at the expense of others toiling ...not you.Where would you be if others didn't work, to get money to buy things for you to mooch off? So i see a lazy wotrthless waste of what i loosely refer to as a man using this unrealistic theory to be a leach. You are a cancer on humanity, and if you believe your theory a fool. Try walking into the alaskan back country with nothing from our evil economy and with no outside assistance see how long you make it.....you would be at the closest garbage dump digging through our scraps again in days if you made it that long. Wake up get a job and contribute in a positve way instead of being a drain on the rest of us.

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  2. Thanks for the comic relief, Anon.

    Your comment is a joke, right?

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  3. But maybe it's not a joke. In which case...

    Making assumptions is pretty fun, eh? But it's actually rational & healthy to ask & get facts before making assumptions. Like, "have you ever lived off the land in the Alaskan back-country or anywhere else?" or, "Do you work?" or, "What is your idea on using computers or other such products of the money system?"
    If it begins this way, I know you are a person receptive to truth. Otherwise, there can be no rational discussion, only futility.

    Cancer, by the way, takes more than it needs and gives less than it takes. Ponder that very deeply, please.

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  4. Well, Anonymous! What of stray dogs? For all the bad rap dogs get, we DO still keep them around. The stray dog aspects of them are the part we usually insult the least. After all, they clean up our environment for us, now don’t they? They are one of God’s vacuum cleaners (along with crows and condors, etc) and very useful in that way, as is ALL of God’s plan. However, there IS a characteristic of dogs that is very repulsive, but even so IT is the characteristic most often emulated by human beings. That is the dog pack syndrome. Have you ever heard of the dog pack syndrome? Have you ever been at the “bottom of the pack”? That is, have you ever had bullies gang up on you, in school, at work, anywhere else? Have YOU been involved in the “dog eat dog” world of money and getting ahead? We excuse our bullying and ganging up on others that are weak and down, even to the point of lying and deception to accomplish it, with great euphemistic terms to make it sound normal and to be expected, but it is a grave breach in our characters that far outweighs a dog eating scraps. Of all wonders it exists most often in our money camps and education-to-make-money camps. It occurs when a dog finds a weakness in another dog and begins to harass the weaker dog to break down its fortitude, so that it gives in to the other’s demands. The rest of the pack sees this going on and does not try to rescue the dog or prey that is down and out, but joins in the “fun”. I watched two dogs kill a cat in this way, literally pulling the cat in two as they gleefully played tug of war with it. Each dog by himself left the cat alone.

    But Anonymous, how come you are so uptight about this? It seems your reaction is awfully strong. I hope YOU aren’t one of those bullies. Bullies are incredibly bothered by anyone that does anything different than themselves or steps away from mainstream society. They love uniformity, everyone in their gang to wear the same clothes and symbols, to do the same things, to all look alike. They beat up on and harass (only when they are in their gang, however, or anonymous) anyone that is different in any way. They don’t beat on someone for being harmful (street gangs and others can be the most DESTRUCTIVE), but for the simple crime of being different. After all, how has Suelo harmed you? Do you have any evidence that he has harmed or stolen from anyone else, destroyed them or their property? People DO keep letting him housesit for them. I don’t think they would allow that if he was vandalizing their houses. And does no job mean he doesn’t work? For pity’s sake, if he DOES do something for someone, we know he did it for love not money!

    I know of a dog pack that is in full force right now. This dog pack, that consists of two churches, people from several towns and cities, and the family, extended family and children of a mother, is in full attack on one of its weakest members. The dog pack consists mostly of people that have jobs. They might even use their money to hire lawyers to carry out their dog pack agenda. It’s a horrible and ungodly sight.

    So think it over Anon. Suelo is loved and trusted. Are you?

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  5. Correction. It isn't just two churches incorporated into the above mentioned dog pack, but at least four churches,a business,as well as all the friends and families in between, spread across four cities and towns,in at least two states. Why is such an army needed for one little dog underneath the pack? Such a pathetic army of cowards! How come their jobs didn't purify them, make them righteous, make what they are doing all better, if jobs are the ultimate thing to strive for? In the end, how are their jobs going to save them, when they stand before God to give account?

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  6. What does all the great info on pack mentality have to do with me, a single person, comenting on the flawed (in my opinion) ideas of another? And this individual that you refer to that is being attacked by this mob prob brought the situation on themselves to have their entire family turn on them.

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  7. Packs DO consist of individuals, you know, Anon. So I was simply wondering if you were a MEMBER of a pack, by the manner with which you were reacting to Suelo. You seemed to be more upset with him being different than against any wrong he has committed. That is a characteristic of the pack MENTALITY (you can have a mentality or way of thinking WITHOUT being in a pack, but you'll love the pack and what they do once you find one).

    You referred to Suelo as being like a stray dog. Well, there are worse characteristics of dogs than being stray and eating scraps. I pointed out one of those characteristics to you and used the illustration to show how getting a job doesn't erase bad character, but can exacerbate it or even be used to perform bad and destructive activities, the JOB being the ultimate goal rather than love and good character. Suelo seems to at least have good character. The evidence for that is that he is TRUSTED as well as loved. I asked you if you could say the same about yourself, but you never answered the question. If you CAN say that you are also loved and trusted, was it your job that made you that way? It certainly could be a MEDIUM through which you could EXPRESS your good and honest character, but it can also be a medium for the very opposite and most destructive actions. For certain your job won't justify you, if you ARE mean and dishonest. You are not going to be able to say at the end when you are standing before God, "Hey! doesn't my job count for something? I DID use it to support myself (and my family?). Doesn't that outweigh the fact that I acted like a dog and destroyed everyone and everything in my path to obtain it and get ahead in it? Oh yes, I neglected my family in the process too, but at least they have money and have learned how to ‘get ahead’ with the dog eat dog tactics I taught them and sent them to school to learn better."

    Now I want to ask you another question. Is that how you set your standards, by the way others respond to you (this person under attack prob. brought it on to him/herself)? Your standard is: not only does the person's bad behavior justify bad and maybe even worse behavior in return, but if others respond with acceptance, you are right. If others get upset, you must be wrong. Hmmm, if that's the case, how CAN you be trusted? What is right one day will be wrong the next, because what one set of people will accept one day, the next group or individual will get very upset by the next day. By that standard of right and wrong the Jews of Germany must have brought their genocide onto themselves. CHRIST must have brought his crucifixion onto Himself!

    But tell me, what is wrong with Suelo eating scraps if people are willing to throw them to him? Why can't he live the way he wants to? YOU don't have to eat scraps. If you don't want him to eat YOUR scraps, however, why did you throw them out so he could get to them? He's lived 5 years on those scraps. HE'S STILL ALIVE TO TELL THE STORY! Therefore those scraps must be good and nutritious food that would otherwise have gone to WASTE. What is worse? Suelo eating scraps, or US hogging to ourselves and wasting our abundant resources? Maybe it would be better and less evil and cultic to stand guard over our scraps to make sure they ROT rather than go into SUELO'S belly. If that’s the case, maybe we’re JEALOUS of Suelo. He’s got a happy smile on his face, while our faces have deep creases of stress and guilt trying to hold our jobs together and keep our money from disappearing so quickly. Really, Anon! Is the stress and loss of our health, humanity and families WORTH the few pieces of metal and paper we gain?

    Well, Anon, you at least came back to read this. You're a good sport in that respect.

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  8. I just don't understand some one who doesn't support our capitalistic society can sustain themselves on others hard work. I see fault in this. I find pride in providing for myself, how it must feel to rely on others pity on a daily basis for survival. I equate you to a beggar or panhandler. And if we all suddenly decided this was a great idea, who would we all mooch our existance from? With out people willing to work to seek food shelter and fulfill other basic needs we would all perish. Yes greed and persuit of mass wealth are sins, but the elimination of a money system will not eliminate these things from a mens hearts.

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  9. And by the way what did this person you gave as an example do to have this large following condem them? just curious

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  10. Hmmm. Let me get this straight, Anon. If a person does not ask money or barter in return for actions, actions are not considered work, and he/she is a moocher? But if a person asks for money or barter in return for actions, actions are considered work, and he/she is respectable?

    By the way, I would rather starve than accept anything on pity.

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  11. "elimination of a money system will not eliminate these things from a mens hearts."
    I agree. Isn't this what I said in the very blog you are commenting on?

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  12. You know, I expect very few people to like this blog. I'd have to be delusional if I thought more than a handful would hear it. And I don't give a hoot if you don't read it. But, for your own dignity's sake, if you are going to comment on it, please read it!

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  13. Wow, what a barrage of comments to find on your blog post, and right after Christmas! I will give them all a read as soon as I get a chance.

    I wish Anonymous and Me (and Me Again) would have revealed their identities. It's easier to understand the person talking when you can see his/her face. No one ever says all that they mean when they speak, but if you can (in the internet world) read more of their thoughts (say, on their blog), you can understand their current expression more fully. Taken out of that context, some of the things I write could make me out to be hysterically bi-polar philosophically.

    Anyway, enough blab for now. Go with God, Suelo amigo mio.

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  14. Well, Romano, first of all it wouldn’t matter if I identified myself or not. Most of you probably don’t know who I am anyway. Then, those that DO know me might take what I’m saying personally and that would throw a wall up for them against the message. Their bad feelings would be the wall. But otherwise, people want to know WHO the speaker is so they can form preconceived ideas about the message, BEFORE they’ve even heard it. First of all, it matters whether the speaker is male or female, and next what occupation he/she has chosen, what religion, what kind of education, and finally what kind of reputation, hearsay or otherwise, they have. If they love the speaker and his lifestyle, they swallow his message without thought. If they hate his job or disrespect her gender, they reject what is said without any further thought. A naked message without the speaker, I think, can sometimes give more objectivity to it, at least at first. However, to give “expression” to my comments, I suppose I could include little icons that are either smiling or frowning or staring in consternation! (I’ll see what I can dig out of my bi-polar bag! He he, real clever, Romano.) By the way, it seems GOOD that we know Suelo’s identity, because his LIFE is evidence for his message. However, I have a feeling he is so loved that some of his followers swallow his teachings without thought too.

    It IS an aspect of good character, Anon, that makes you want to provide for yourself. But is the way of capitalism the only way to do that? And once we’ve overrun the earth with asphalt and cement and destroyed everyone’s spirits and our own with our lust, will our desires THEN be satiated and our needs provided for at last? We ALL know better than that. Wouldn’t there be, once capitalism and dumpsters were gone, another way to provide for our and our families’ basic needs? Are we so inventive with our modern technology, but can’t figure out how to do what “dumb” creatures and generations of hardy humans have done for centuries before, and that is how to survive on basic needs? You are right that the problem resides in the heart of man, not in the money itself, but at the look of things, something possesses a person once they give themselves over to the “system”. Where no wood is the fire goes out! I admire Suelo for questioning the system, getting out of it, doing more than talking about it, but LIVING OUT a different way. Even if he’s dead wrong, he at least has left the herd and is thinking for himself. The rest of us are like buffalo or lemmings, stampeding over the cliff, not knowing that the cliff even exists. However, if we open our eyes for even a moment we HAVE to admit the system is failed.

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  15. First of all, brother Me, please try to have some respect! My name is NOT "Romano", which you keep calling me. It is "Romanós" (pronounced Ro-man-OSS). And I don't quite understand what I might've said to cause you to unleash the backlash that starts with your words, "…those that DO know me might take what I’m saying personally and that would throw a wall up for them against the message." From that point on, you continue with a rant against what people might unjustly hold against you. I don't know if you're implying that I am in that category, and I suppose I shouldn't care. I'm just surprised to find such a pessimistic paranoid pit-bull attitude in print. Suelo and I are pretty mellow fellows, and I'd expect people to have some courtesy.

    That being said, I will go back to water the vegetables.

    Oh, by the way, Suelo, nice images you plopped into your latest post!

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  16. Oh good grief, Romanos (sorry about the misspell), I didn't realize I was coming across that way (I should have put a few smiley faces)! I didn't have you in mind at all or any ONE person in mind,and wasn't ranting, just stating what I've observed about people, that they seem to have a need to pigeon hole. (How come when they see a baby the first thing they ask is, Is it a boy or a girl? They want to know so they can treat the baby in a certain way, I assume.) It wasn't even a negative criticism, just an observation I gave so you'd understand why I was withholding who I was.

    You have a garden or greenhouse?

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  17. who is this that has all these relatives, churches, and a business, calling them to account. with that kind of drum roll, I'd think a normal person would figure they might have done something offencesive, instead of calling those, who no doubt care enough,to say something, a pack of dogs. something doesn't add up.

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  18. Now if I may be the diplomat...

    I can see how Me's comments could be taken as rant against somebody. But I read them as tongue-in-cheek humor, and concepts of not forming prejudices in the best of people, including myself. Ah, if we could see each person as not a product of the past, but a product of the present! Without assumptions, with the eyes of an infant!

    Assumptions! Often lynch mobs can insanely attack one minority for no other reason than it is a minority, and yet at other times there is wisdom in the crowd. This is the challenge of life, separating the wisdom of the crowd from the insanity of the crowd.

    Either way, the lynch mob is also part of the game, and it is our refining process, and can even be part of the fun if we let it. But in defense of pack dogs, it is unlikely they run on prejudices (assumptions). We know that lynch mobs are driven by prejudices (assumptions). How do I know if I'm part of the lynch mob? If I am driven by assumptions. Hey, Anon?

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  19. that came out wrong. "In the best of people, including myself" sounds like I'm putting myself in the "best" category & that's not what I wanted to say.

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  20. when you say: that came out wrong, are you referring to you're previous comment, or you're birth, or you're entire life. Life is rampant with purposeful disruption, and if you're role, is to be a key player in this distraction, then I comprehend the apology. Since we live in a zone that’s wired for chaos navigation is a thorny problematic road full of dangerous dead ends. You’re expressions, emit a disgusting discharge exhibiting an aroma of decay in the jaws of one of these dead ends.

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  21. Hey! Freespirit (hope I spelled that right), WHAT about Suelo's expressions emits such a disgusting result? How come you feel so badly toward him? Did he do something wrong against you?

    By the way, Suelo, did you know that many of the writings we call "myths" are actually incredibly verified HISTORY. The accounts actually took place and the names are NOT mythologolical but real names that form awesome geneologies of peoples that really existed. The beasts in these "myths" can also be verified as real animals that did exist. For some reason, the historians are bent on hiding this wealth of INFORMATIVE material.

    Romanos (can't find the accent on my computer to put over the "o"), I really do feel badly that I was disrespectful to you, as I SINCERELY did not intend to be that way. I do hope you can forgive me and come back to this very interesting fray. I've enjoyed reading your comments as well as all the others.

    Hey Romanós! I figured it out (the accent)!

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  22. Ah, I can now identify who "freespirit" is! All things hidden come to light.

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  23. Alt-0243 is the accented ó, right! Aren't alt-keys cool? I don't know what I'd do without them.

    Thank you, Suelo amigo mio, for finally having a blog post that actually causes people to comment. That's what I thought blogging was for, but in the case of mine, I think I just get spectators.

    I'm not really used to the roughness in the dialog going on here and, thankfully, I really have nothing material to add to the "fray" (as Me calls it).

    There is a really ftupid (yes, I meant to type it that way, try saying it, it's fun!), a really ftupid blogpost on money happening on "Following the Rabbi" (eBlogger). One commentator is asking if he's supposed to tithe on a gift card! Hmm, well, that got me going on "tithing" per se, and I left a little comment there which I also stole and posted on my blog under the title "Money Talk."

    I advised the youth pastor whose ftupid blog I commented on to visit Suelo's blog, that is, if he is seriously planning to do a teaching series on "money" in January. I wonder if he will? I hope he does. He's got a lot to learn…

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  24. I do like the image of a small child: I’m not trying to rule the roost, I don’t want to be king of the mountain.
    I haven’t meddled where I have no business or fantasized grandiose plans. I’ve kept my feet on the ground,
    I’ve cultivated a quiet heart. Like a baby content in its mother’s arms, my soul is a baby content.

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  25. Quoth the cultivated quiet baby heart: "You’re expressions, emit a disgusting discharge exhibiting an aroma of decay in the jaws of one of these dead ends."

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  26. Money does equal power and a vast variety of other evils come along with power and money in our lives when we our lacking God
    1 Timothy 6:10 - For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

    Money can control us whether we possess it or not. If you choose a lifestyle that does not involve money, kudos, but only if you’re focusing your attention on enriching the world in other Godly ways.
    I can’t help but notice and agree with Anonymous. No matter how you justify it, you will in fact be using someone else’s money whether it just be the smallest usage such as loggin onto the Internet a few days a week because moneys tangled fingers are enwrapped in and around every part of our very existence. But good luck on your escape of it, that being your main goal in life, I suppose it is rather intriguing. For those of us that raise our children, work hard, and use money to live. That is life, lets make sure regardless of our path whether it is lined with gold or not at all. That it is all given to God, he in fact blessed us.
    When I searched the scriptures to see how God involved or did not use money in his life, I noticed that he is very fond of Gold
    Rev 14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
    Prov 19: 14-15 House and riches are the inheritance of fathers: and a prudent wife is from the LORD. Slothfulness casteth into a deep sleep; and an idle soul shall suffer hunger.


    As for this other persons blog about churches and family being against them, it reminds me of a verse I recollect…mothers will turn against there children, children against there parents. I don’t have the exact verse in front of me but it’s one of the prophecies in the bible, a sign of the 2nd coming.
    I do wonder what this person did to become a “martyr” as they put it? And they liken themselves to dogs, and packs of dogs. This reminds me of a different analogy animal, such as cows. The weaker cow is placed in the middle of the herd as the stronger ones form a circle of protection around it attacking the animal that is after the weakest member of the herd. Perhaps it was attacked when others were not around, or did not notice. They have refocused, forming a circle


    Prov. 19:5
    A false witness shall not be unpunished; and he that speaketh lies shall not escape.



    I wondered does “me” relish in being a martyr, a martyr is talked quit highly of in the Bible. Maybe they feel better about themselves, possibly overcompensating for something that they have done in their life? I know that over time truth prevails, because truth is more powerful then money, or lies.

    It is hard to face up to where we go wrong, but being a Christian also carries the burden of having all of ours sins and wrongdoings brought into the light. As a Christian I have noticed that God holds us accountable to himself and to the people around us. We then choose to either repent, ask for forgiveness, or we try to rationalize away everything wrong that we have done. Rather then try to mend relationships, we just completely deny all of our wrongdoings and accuse everyone around us. Someone, or several voice deep pain from their past and are accused of joining in a “fun” attack. The wrongs were never acknowledged; rather someone wrongs repeatedly with denial, excuses, manipulation and control all very devastatingly harmful to a young child’s mind.

    But I will rise and applaud those who rise from those ashes, using their pain as a fuel to better their life, work hard, and decide that the behavior will stop where it started and it will not be passed down to their offspring. All of this only possible through forgiveness and forgiving someone who denies all they have done is the hardest form of forgiveness. But it can remind us for a moment how Christ felt forgiving the entire world generation after generation with most of human kind denying all of their wrong. Some would expect a certain type of apology to gain forgiveness, if Christ expected this we would never gain eternal life.

    Nothing in life is as important as our soul and the souls of those who walk around us we should hold these dear, rather then letting anger, guilt, denial, & rationalization cloud our mind.

    John 8:32 - And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

    Life is hard, but it is all a test for our eternal life. God gives us choices everyday, and each path we choose has a difficult ending. We ourselves are the only ones we can hold accountable for our choices. You can’t blame everyone around you for the choices you make? I am sorry, but it will ruin your very mental stability.

    Our focus should not be on money or lack of, but rather on the precious human life around us. Children are a blessing, mend those relationships, do whatever it takes. If you have wronged then ask for forgiveness, don’t blame your wrong on everyone around you.

    I can tell you nothing is as spiritual as feeling for a moment the unique joy of Christ, who is a undying example of true forgiveness. Someone once asked me how I could still remain friends with them after everything they had done to me, I said I truly forgave you and that’s in the past now, your wrongdoing wont control my future. I can now love them more then I thought I did before they wronged me. I no longer hate them or embitter myself over a past that I have no control over; rather I chose to love them unconditionally. It released me; my soul was no longer indebted to them. I think true love is loving someone after they have wronged you because you forgive them and have no resent?

    Its very obvious that “me” feels strong dislike for many, it appears to be close to hate possibly? Great disdain? Love them that hate you…..
    Mark 10:19 - Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
    I hope your witness stand drips with honesty, no exaggeration, no self preservation.
    Does adultery go hand in hand with honoring our father and mother? When we slip in one area do we stop honoring our parents?

    John 8:32 - And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

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  27. Yea! I think we all know who freespirit is. Some people don't need a name. "By their fruits ye shall know them."

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  28. You have stated some wise words, Truth.
    I know that this discussion actually has little to do with this blog - becoming a way for some of my biological family members to work out problems in an anonymous way. I see the viewpoint of "Me" and those of the other family members, and both have elements of truth, and yet maybe both sides are making assumptions. Please excuse us, the rest of you. This stuff probably doesn't make much sense to you. But who am I to say what is appropriate for this blog & what is not?

    Now, back to the subject of this blog: I ask, am I in any way judging those of you who work hard to support your families with money? Am I saying I am better than you or "justifying" myself? It is good to call me on these things.

    And, yes, if getting away from money is my goal, then money is as much a hinderence to me as if I hoarded it, loved it. My brother told me this once. Good advice.

    But please read what I say under the heading "Prostitution: Real or Illusion?" It is not that we use or not use money, as Truth is saying, but that we first love. "We love him because he first loved us." And He loves us through each other. I am not for the abolishment of money, but for love first. And if we as a human group truly love each other, we will eventually find there is no more need for money. Just read the blog again and think about it. Everything, no matter how impossible, begins with vision. Visionaries always look foolish.

    We can discuss why I use products of the money system later, and whether or not I am being hypocritical. I am open that I very well may be. And we can discuss the "fondness of gold" in the Bible, too, and its context.

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  29. I think money/riches/gold is all fine and dandy and I also give back to God from my stack. But the LOVE of money is evil!

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  30. me, the thing that wrinkles my nose is this allusion to superiority through cashless ness and the subtle overtones of inferiority draped on anyone who has some of that medium of exchange. Everyone works, even the person holding a sign asking for provision is working. so are you achieving more if you get small change for you're efforts or get nothing. I think this seelow outfit is a put down monger who mixes jazzy expressions to make himself look a cut above. How did you get all the bad repute, you never said. truth has some strong thoughts but who is this family and these rabid dogs

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  31. Truth, your words were well spoken. You sound like a merciful person. Something a merciful person has to keep in mind though is that the people brought from the outside into a situation where a lot of painful things are occurring might even hurt worse than those actually going through the problems. I think that is because God doesn’t give observers and outsiders grace or power for someone else’s problem(s). He gives each of us strength for OUR day and grace for OUR OWN problems, not each others. So we all have to be careful about taking up offenses for others. I’m probably the worst for doing it, so I speak out of personal experience, believe me. Later I’ve seen the whole story or situation and been ashamed of my contribution. I’ve ended up being a Job’s Comforter that needs praying for, rather than a strength and guide.

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  32. I've read a lot of words flying around this post, and most of it is far above my head. I've never felt that Suelo was kicking himself up a notch over the rest of us because of his moneyless philosophy or his attempts to practice it. There's a ring of truth in much of what he says, and it must be nice to have gone "underground" relative to mainstream society. I am in some senses also living "underground" to that society myself, just by being a follower of Jesus.

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  33. Okay, let's just spell this out simply. Take only what you need and leave the rest. This is everything I am saying in a nutshell.

    When we take more than we need, others suffer for it. The more positives you accumulate, the more negatives happen. Basic physics 101. Anything more than taking what we need is greed. Greed is robbery. Greed causes suffering, duh. Lazarus takes at least what he needs, but most likely less than needs, living off the crumbs that fall from Rich Man's excess. He is a stray dog with the stray dogs who lick his wounds. And now I hear Rich Man telling Lazarus he is a bum, a cancer of society. Lazarus imposes on nobody, asks for nothing, hurts nobody.

    You, oh Capitalist Society, take way, way, way more than you need! And you are so anal you even lock up your dumpsters, for fear that some Lazarus "is going to get something for nothing." And you fear that people will see that you throw away enough food to feed the whole world every week. You steal, and then condemn those you've stolen from for scraping up a few of the crumbs you drop. You don't give those crumbs freely, but drop them inadvertantly. And the crumbs you do give, you give with tooting horns and fanfare. It's all about making yourself appear righteous, not about defending the poor.

    Martha is resentful against Mary because Mary is slaving and Mary has realized that the simple life, the non-slaving life, is the abundant and only happy life. Is Martha's resentfulness Mary's fault?

    I'm just living life, forcing nothing, and all I want is to communicate this joy of liberation to you, too. Take only what you need. Do only what you need to do, and no more, without guilt (debt, sin). Sit at the feet of Jesus. If you think my sitting at Jesus' feet is putting myself above you, is that my problem or yours?

    Then, we, to justify our greed, say that Jesus' clear teachings are for another dispensation "before the cross" and "after the church age" then have to deal with the "Church age" books of Acts and the book of James - and all the New Testament for that matter. Just read James and let's hear how we can explain its clear, clear message away.

    Don't worry, we're not alone. Buddhist greed-heads do the same, saying that Buddha's teachings are for another dispensation. Taoists & Hindus & Sikhs play that game, too. But all the theological explanations in the world aren't going to erase the blatant facts before our eyes!

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  34. you may be correct r......s i'd rather leave gain of whatever out of the equating. everyone is trying in this expression to nurture the other and explore the heart of the idiom being used and maybe this is all eyeball to eyeball heart to heart nourishment.
    Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind; Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being ensamples to the flock. Maybe seelow has a good thought although filthy lucre is going to hang around no matter what, but having to feel this restraint and pressure to help others based on it is a heavy deal. Actually any constraint is highly unattractive like me says taking up a cause for someone else can be a squeeze on the ticker too. And we all have stuff we would like to erase from the record sounds like there is not a case of prejudicial bias as post judicial disposition. It’s difficult to be judicious when I see some raw feelings being exposed.

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  35. Correction: "Martha is resentful against Mary because MARTHA is slaving..."

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  36. I think they might lock dumpsters so lazyrus doesn’t get bad spinach and sue the safe way. Or maybe lazy rustler finds cool stuff in ye olde dumper that he can swagger around the front with for a little return action

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  37. you know i still have this creepy crawly feeling that someone is freelancing for the devil. Talkin a good line of peace and moonlighting for the bad guy. This gives me the heebie jeebie’s . but maybe there’s a payoff to doin the naughty guys stuff. Some hidden bonus.

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  38. Sometimes dumps are locked so people don't steal other people's personal information and use it too fraud there SSN and CC info... Sometimes these days its hard to live off snagles when we have evil people who steal personal info. Also, ya what if you ate a tasty old peace of pork and got ouchy tumm and had to be hospitalized, later the store is responsible.

    And I don't think that you can ever work too hard... Do all you do as unto the Lord and not to men, and By the sweat of your brow.
    And if you are blessed to make an abundance of riches give to the Lord and use it to help others, but if others aren't working why should we help them? Get a job at Mc Donald's! I RESPECT hard workers, even if the job is humiliating and doesn't make much. at least your working and contributing so our CHILDREN can be fed and clothed and sheltered! EASY to talk like this when you have NO children. Also work to help the elderly and sick and those unable to work. If you can work then WORK! But yes being waist-full is wrong, and hording money is wrong.

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  39. There is NOTHING free in life except the gift of God, eternal life.

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  40. Bold, I like what you have to say. Don't forget though, that you can work HARD even if you don't have a job. Remember what Peter said to the lame man? "Silver and gold have I NONE; but such as I HAVE give I thee...." You CAN give, even if it isn't money!

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  41. Are you ASSUMING I don't work?
    Tell me what is NOT a gift of God? And what is NOT a gift of God I don't want. And if work is not a gift to God, I don't want to do it. And who is my family, my mother, my sisters, my brothers, my children?

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  42. Well I see most of you are going at a biblical angle. So I’m curious, where in the bible does it say money is wrong? Cattle were also used to buy. Does that make them wrong also? Christ paid the price of death. Does that make Him wrong? Also, I don't know right off my head the verse, but doesn’t God say something about wasting time? Cause money right or wrong seems to me like a huge wast of time to even argue about. Kind of like "now let’s contemplate on whether or not Adam had a belly button". Where is it helping anyone in life? And, well "me" I see it as an offence for you to be relating people to dogs. Seeing as God always mentioned them along with vultures as a curse. Aren’t we the lambs? And the dogs are the demons running through the flock devouring?
    Well, "suelo" this is something you believe. None of us have the right to judge you for that. I do NOT see how it is helping you or anyone else in anyway. As a father of 5, I do not see it possible to live that way. But as long as your not telling any one to live that way, than I don’t see where arguing is necessary.

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  43. Maybe a revisionist is rewriting the dictionary, adjusting balance scales, and fiddling with the boundary markers. Work then can be lifting the covers off you’re torso in the morning or raising the shades to see if there’s a lion in the street. I’m wary of anyone who claims they’ve arrived at some personal success based on their life choices which could be death choices. Suspicion is the shield to lift up when someone writes, making claims, as the author of a scheme, with his proposal bulging with the continual word “I” “I” “I”, this is a usurper indicator. The tenor of the assumptive, presuming on you’re space with alien and weird substance. Isn’t that what Eve and Adam got stumbled with, a clever redefiner. A being who said I Will I Will got a few people off track. Sounds like see-low is a little under the sun, sub solar, the altitude of these views is about knee-high to a shoe height. If he’s a fruitcake ye shall know him.

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  44. ionlywantu2c is correct. Money is not wrong, but is a teacher until we come to a state of Grace. This is the whole point of this blog. When we are in school, we need gold stars to motivate us, or A's, B's, C's, D's, F's, until we come to the point of working VOLUNTARILY, working because we WANT to work. Kids who still need gold stars, and have pure hearts, aren't worried about whether or not other kids are "working" or if it's possible for them to work without gold stars. A kid pure in heart just does her own work, with or without gold stars, for the end purpose of doing ALL work as gift, without the need for gold stars. This is called maturity.

    As far as dogs & vultures go, as a symbol they can be compared to demons in scripture, but not always. To the impure of heart, dogs and vultures are impure. To the pure, all things are pure. Doesn't God call everything he creates "good"? For this reason, we sometimes need to take the role of the dog or vulture, or the "cursed one" hanging on the Tree.

    If I am judging anybody for using money, I am wrong. If I am judging anybody with families, I am wrong. If I am saying anybody MUST live like me, I am wrong. If this is all about I and me, then I am wrong. But this blog is about getting us all to question the status quo, and whether or not we are following our own professed faith.

    I am glad that you say that you "don't SEE it as possible to live that way" rather than saying it IS impossible to live that way. The early church lived without possessions, communally, as a group (see Acts 2 & 4). The Kingdom of God is for the Assembly, not loners. Now if we decide to live as Christ, not I, implored, we will sacrifice our own reputations and be ostracized by our own "churches" and families, guaranteed. Christ promised that, too, along with untold blessings. There is no way to God accept by the Cross.

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  45. I will also say thank you, ionlywantu2c, for not having a hard heart. Nice to see in these comments.

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  46. Yes "suelo" money can be very much related to a gold star. And who’s to say with out it anyone will still work? And survival would be impossible without work. I can see you don’t seem to like it when anyone understands you to be saying work is wrong. Well money and work do go hand in hand. Money is our motivation.
    As for the world will be a better place if we all learned to work together without the “motivation”, I myself have thought about that. That will happen soon enough, when we get to heaven. As for down here on earth? That asks for world peace. The anti christ will try to push it, but it wont be righteous. The only world peace will be when God comes to earth for his years of reigning. Otherwise your looking at a lost cause. We need to focus on turning peoples hearts to Christ. Not pushing world peace.

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  47. One more thing. Yes God did call EVERYTHING, good. BUT that was in the garden when everything was good. Even humans were good. But we fell. Bringing everything against its brother. Even our right is as filthy rags in God’s eyes. Yes God has compassion for every creature. I love dogs myself. BUT as an “ANELOGY” do not call me a dog.

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  48. So what if someone uses "I" a lot (though it didn't seem like Suelo was excessive in the use of "I")? Not only are we an Assembly, we are also individuals. God MADE us that way, so we could individually TESTIFY to His work and grace in our lives TO the Assembly and by each individual witness, build up the Assembly.

    I know. It seems like I defend Suelo a lot. Don't worry, we've gotten on each other's cases quite severely too. But what I appreciate about him is that he has stepped out of the stampede and gotten us all to think. Isn't it TIME we started thinking?

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  49. Suelo said...

    Are you ASSUMING I don't work?
    Tell me what is NOT a gift of God? And what is NOT a gift of God I don't want. And if work is not a gift to God, I don't want to do it. And who is my family, my mother, my sisters, my brothers, my children?

    9:49 PM

    Ecc 3:13 And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labour, it [is] the gift of God.

    Labour brings food and drink which is a gift of God not to God. So you don't want to do it unless YOU have the glory not God. Hmmmm... Praise God, give thanks to God, glorify your Saviour... But He needs no gifts from you only humble servant-hood and spreading His word to others. The chief end of man is to glorify God and enjoy Him forever.

    I. To the glorifying of God, which is one part of man's chief end.

    II. To the enjoyment of God forever, wherein man's chief happiness consists, and which he is to seek as his chief good.

    1 Cor. 10:31...Whether therefore ye eat or drink, or whatever ye do, do all to the glory of God.

    Psal. 73:25, 26...Whom have I in heaven but thee? and there is none upon earth that I desire beside thee. My flesh and my heart faileth; but God is the strength of my heart and my portion for ever.

    And who is your family, mother, sister, brothers, children? Duh... Rich, Laurel, Ron, Doug, Rick, Pennie (you don't have children) and the Shelabargers (not sure if I have spelled correctly) Oh, wait! Are you quoting Jesus Christ as your own words? Are you God and have no brothers and sisters etc? Wow! Say... has someone lost it? Well, God be the Judge!

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  50. Ok now ive been thinking about it a little more. “suelo” to my understanding your voicing what would make the world a better place. Am I right?
    Ok, now, I see nothing wrong with over using the word “I”. Isn’t there a whole chapter in the old testament FULL of I’s ? Sorry I’m not totally sure which one, maybe it was written by Solomon?
    Now with that said. I am going to fill this up with “I’s . :)
    Now sure we all wish the world was better, so much more easy. Easy is comfortable. Well, when I pray I don’t thank God that my life is so easy, I thank him for each and every hard thing I face, each thing that pushes me ridiculously close to unable to handle, because that is what makes me stronger, that is what brings me closer to God. When I pray, I don’t thank God for the people outside the clinic yelling. I thank Him for the abortion going on inside. Because THAT is what brings people to question. I don’t pray for war to stop. I thank Him for the war. Because it gives us a deep yearning for a haven of rest, something, anything, that will give us a break from the pain and suffering. It pushes us into action to FIND. And isn’t Christ the only place we find rest? Personally I DO NOT want the world to be better. I pray that for the sake of everyone else, this earth will be the worst possible experience. Cause THAT is what pushes us closer to the only place of rest, which is in Christ.

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  51. All I pray is that professed Christians actually become Christians, which means believing in the teachings of Jesus. You all have them and know what they say.

    Let's take them one at a time.

    "You cannot serve both God and money." Your master is who you work for, right? Is this MY opinion or a simple observation? If you work for money, you are a servant of money. If you cannot work without money motivation, you are a servant of money. And if you are a servant of money, according to Jesus, you cannot be a servant of God. Is any of this my opinion? Is anything in this blog my opinion or simple observation?

    Everthing is a gift of God. Everthing is a gift to God. And the gift to God can only be from God within. All else is not real. A gift is not a gift unless it is free. If it is from us, from our own works, we have reason to boast, to be proud. If it is motivated by ANYTHING but God, it is nothing but filthy rags. Yes, Ecclesiastes says it, as Bold quotes. Our purpose is to enjoy the work of our hands. If the reward is not in the doing, it is not a gift, and it can't be enjoyed. We are to live life abundantly NOW. NOW is the day of salvation, NOW is the accepted time. The Kingdom of God is at hand. If not NOW, then never. There is no other Reality but NOW. There is nothing else but YHWH. It is your mind that is looking for heaven after you die, pie in the sky, that is the mind without faith. Whatever is without faith is sin. We are saved by faith, not our works, and we walk by faith, not our works. All true work is from God and to God alone. There is none other. Your faithlessness, professed Christian, is stripping the God-ordained joy out of life, and shirking responsibility. Christ is inside us, our hope of glory. Christ's words are our words, as the sap in the branches is the sap in the vine. I have no Father but One, and everyone who does the will of God is my mother, my brother, sister, children.

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  52. Yes, heaven comes after we die. "I die daily."

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  53. I was impressed with what folks, such as Bold and Ionlywantu2c, were saying! I’ve been reading a lot of wise words. I also want to qualify what I said about dog packs. Not ALL those that are pulled into a gang or "pack" are really pack members or have pack mentality. Such as Truth. It seems she is one of those that isn’t a pack member. It seems she (he?) has been pulled into the situation and her merciful nature has caused her to take up a reproach against the person under attack.

    A more accurate description for the crowd involved that aren’t pack members is “flock”. (One of you said we were all rather "lambs" than dogs. You are right. The Bible says we are all LIKE sheep--that have gone astray. We have gone every one to our own way. He also calls us the sheep of His pasture in a certain place and that He is our Shepherd. Sure enough, we, like sheep, however, follow the flock. We aren't necessarily bullies or pack members because we do that. Some are, and we have to admit that. But most of us are simply sheep following the herd. My mistake was making a generality with no qualifications. It came across as hatred and hostility, to Truth. I really didn't mean for it to come across that way and am sorry it happened. Neither was I targeting my comments at the attacked person's offenders, not expecting them to even be reading my comments. I was attempting to make a point to Anon about what he/she said about Suelo being like a stray dog.

    I really think that all that is happening against this person being attacked is going to be a great blessing in the person's life. The person will most likely be brought to his/her knees in total helplessness to God and the sin in his/her life acknowledged and washed in the blood of Christ. Hopefully, this IS what will happen. Then the person will know the love, forgiveness and presence of God like no one else can know that hasn’t been brought through such a fiery trial. Afterward, if it so please God, he/she will be vindicated before a multitude. I don't think God involves huge throngs in a situation that involves false accusations unless He has a great vindication to make before them all.

    Another thing I wanted to say is that some of us do God's will voluntarily. Others of us are constrained, like Simon was, to carry the cross for Christ. Still others of us are totally given over to our own wills. BUT, no matter HOW we carry out God’s will, voluntarily or involuntarily, we will STILL do God's will. Judas thought he was doing his own will when he betrayed Christ, but he actually was working God’s plan out to the blessing of the whole world.

    I might venture to say that the three men that have been the GRANDEST blessing to us have been Adam, who caused the fall of the entire human race, Judas who betrayed Christ to be crucified and Christ Who was sacrificed for our sins. How would we ever know the EXTENT and POWER of love, if we had never become so loveless as the Fall has made us? How would we have ever seen the Light of Christ so brightly if it hadn’t gotten so dark in this world? How can we ever save ourselves any more than a drowning man can save himself? So NOW we know Christ as more than an Edenic friend. We know Him as a SAVIOR that went to the furthest extent of love to save us. We could have never known that without needing a Savior. We could never know power over sin if there had been no sin. Judas brought our Savior to the judgment hall. Christ’s enemies blessed us by killing the sacrifice, like Judicial priests.

    So, dog packs, vultures, sheep? They/WE are ALL part of God’s plan, doing his will! Therefore, how can we be angry or hateful against anybody?

    A Greek woman in the Gospels pled with Jesus to cast a demon out of her daughter. Jesus replied to her that the children (Jews) should be fed first. It wasn't appropriate to feed a dog (Gentile) the children's bread. Instead of walking away in a huff that she had been called a dog, she instead wisely replied with an answer that revealed her incredible faith and humility, "Yes, Lord, yet the DOGS under the table eat of the children's crumbs. Her daughter was healed that instant.

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  54. Suelo amigo y hermano mio, just be at peace, and give glory to God!

    Lost in the woods of their words, men vie with each other for the prize of owning the Truth, yet like the earth, the Truth cannot be owned, but the Truth can own us, the one who is the Truth can confess us as His before the angels and before His Father in heaven.

    Besides our works and our righteousness which are as filthy rags, we have nowhere to turn but to the Lord. You know that. Your commentators know that. Have you noticed that those of us who love purely (not expecting return), believe simply (not debating the Word, but doing it), and live knowingly (the life of heaven on earth), are usually strangers to debate? What is there to say? What to defend? We know who it is we have believed in, we know who or what is our judge.

    The world grows weary of us, but we stand on the Rock and cannot be moved. Meanwhile the current, the ebb and flow, washes away their sandy foundations. Who is our accuser? Who the accuser of the brethren?

    We do not cry out for mercy in vain, for the Lord of Hosts is our shield and our salvation. Against our own selves even, we cry out to the One for mercy who alone can give it. He proves now and will prove forever that He loves us, that He always loved us, that He was the lover we always sought, that He it was that led us on in His holy trail, that the details were only that, no more than details, and that He was there all the time, beside us, inside us, to right, to left, above, below, before our face and guarding our back, as we ran in pursuit of Him.

    Jesus.

    The snow is on the hills of my heart and to speak is to die.
    The men at arms to seek to mark me and the monks, raise hue and cry.
    Seek me in vain on Golgotha, or in fear's hollow,
    for the way I take today, only the true may follow.

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  55. Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name. And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.

    That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?

    Behind the scenes you brew cauldrons of evil,
    behind closed doors you make deals with demons.
    The wicked crawl from the wrong side of the cradle;
    their first words out of the womb are lies.
    Poison, lethal rattlesnake poison,
    drips from their forked tongues—
    Deaf to threats, deaf to charm,
    decades of wax built up in their ears.
    God, smash their teeth to bits,
    leave them toothless tigers.
    Let their lives be buckets of water spilled,
    all that’s left, a damp stain in the sand.
    Let them be trampled grass
    worn smooth by the traffic.
    Let them dissolve into snail slime, be a miscarried fetus that never sees sunlight.
    Before what they cook up is half-done, God, throw it out with the garbage!
    The righteous will call up their friends when they see the wicked get their reward,
    The righteous shall rejoice when he seeth the vengeance: he shall wash his feet in the blood of the wicked. 11 So that a man shall say, Verily there is a rewardd for the righteous: verily he is a God that judgeth in the earth.

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  56. Wow this has gone completely sideways from my origional post.Good things have been said here and some things, in my opinion,have stemmed from pure insanity and deliusion.The direction that this has turned has become a matter that is no longer my business but since "me" you state your self that you like what "truth" has to say, take a long look at the verse that they repeatedly quoted : "John 8:32 - And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." And also look to their other script:"Prov. 19:5
    A false witness shall not be unpunished; and he that speaketh lies shall not escape." I would study hard on these before this person being attacked by these horrible dogs would think to expect a pleasant audience from their family or the lord. And to suelo i wish you no ill will, only that you will someday realize the value in positivly participating in our world.

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  57. Yes, Anon, I will pass this on to this person and hope that the person will take it to heart. Since it is Christ that says of Himself that He is the Way, the TRUTH and the Life, this person should be happy to embrace the Truth, knowing it is a person's protection, rather than something to fear. Truth will ultimately be on the person's side and Truth will be the freedom of those in prison. We can ALL trust in that.

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  58. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  59. “suelo” whose to say who is working FOR money? Maybe some people do. But who has the right to judge? Not me not you. Who has the right to be angry? Not me not you. I do not work for money. I work for my survival, and my family. All money is, is notes on paper that prove how much I have worked. MONEY, is not evil. It is the LOVE of it that is evil. LET GOD be the judge of our hearts.
    No not everything is a gift from God. Death is not. Decay is not. Waist is not. Hate is not. Anger is not. I’m not even sure you could call salvation a gift. We have to work for it. NOT by our hands, but by our hearts, we have to work to change the direction, the feelings, and the pride, in our heart. Yes He uses EVERYTHING toward our benefit.
    You die daily. What are you trying to get at saying that? Not quite sure I totally understood. Well it takes the death of heart, mind, and body, to actually be taken to be with God. Dieing to self doesn’t have a whole lot to do with that. And I haven’t seen any chariots lately.
    “me” you have said it is good to step out of the crowd. BUT what about this verse you just quoted? “””The Bible says we are all like sheep--that have gone astray. We have gone every ONE to our OWN way.””” Did He say we were all going the same way? NO. We are already each one of us gone our OWN way. Is it not stupid for a sheep to go its own way? Is that not when the wolves are able to single them out from the flock? How about lets not step out and put our selves in danger. Lets follow the shepherd.
    “me” said:
    “””Another thing I wanted to say is that some of us do God's will voluntarily. Others of us are constrained, like Simon was, to carry the cross for Christ. Still others of us are totally given over to our own wills. BUT, no matter HOW we carry out God’s will, voluntarily or involuntarily, we will STILL do God's will. Judas thought he was doing his own will when he betrayed Christ, but he actually was working God’s plan out to the blessing of the whole world.”””
    Simon was bodily constrained. But was his heart, or mind? Our will is constrained by NOONE. Our will is one thing that will ALWAYS be free. Judas was doing completely his own will. He WAS NOT working God’s plan out. God was the one working His own plan out. Working around and by others stupid stupid actions. Simon has NOTHING whatsoever to do with the praise toward my God. We very rarely do God’s will. But obviously He will plug on, through, and right past. Nothing gets in His way. Both Adam and Judas were a blessing to NO ONE. God is the one who plugged on through their stupidity. Thank you Lord for the pain in my life. Others have caused it. But YOU are the one who works through it. You are the one with the strength to drive on. The one that holds me closer to you. Alls I need is to open my heart to it. The reason we can’t be angry and hateful, is because we HAVE NO RIGHT. We are simple little human beings, it is not our place to be angry and hateful. Alls that accomplishes is making us look more stupid, and causes others to turn a deaf ear.
    “Romanos” Never have I tried to own the truth. I fight for it. But to own it? IMPOSABLE.
    “Me” Again, yes pass it on. But also lets work on our own hearts.

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  60. Yes, I'wantu2c, we are supposed to look INTO the mirror of the Word, not shine the mirror in everyone else's eyes. You are right there.

    What salvation are you talking about that we have to work for? If it is salvation from eternal damnation, how come God calls THAT a FREE GIFT? Otherwise to save our lives here on earth, or to make them count for eternity, yes, we have to work those out.

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  61. Oh yes, another thing, "Enter ye in at the strait gate, for WIDE is the gate, and BROAD is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and MANY THERE BE WHICH GO IN THEREAT: Because strait is the gate, and NARROW is the way, which leadeth unto life, and FEW THERE BE THAT FIND IT."

    "Thou shalt not follow a multitude to do evil; NEITHER SHALT THOU SPEAK IN A CAUSE TO DECLINE AFTER MANY TO WREST JUDGMENT"

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  62. Is it not work to put away pride and turn our hearts to recieve Christ as our saviour?
    dose He call it free? didn't He pay for it through death?

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  63. no works do NOT bring us to christ. But it is work to turn our hearts.

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  64. I was a little struck with whiplash as I did a double take on the statement below, shared by this person “me” that: Judas thought he was doing his own will when he betrayed Christ, but he actually was working God’s plan out to the blessing of the whole world.

    It’s a very gracious statement made by Joseph to his brothers who betrayed him and lied to their father Jacob, about what happened to their brother, to cover their sin of rage and violence. Joseph displays amazing tact to see God in their self inflated injustice. Gen 45:7 But God sent me ahead of you to preserve for you a remnant on earth and to save your lives by a great deliverance. But the agony and grief of his father standing there holding his sons garment drenched in blood, the 13 years in jail over the false accusation of rape by a silly woman, the kind of woman who longed for a man to creep into her house and lead her captive. But Joseph didn’t buy into that plan, and yes God used it to put iron into his soul, but woe to these brothers, woe to this man who creeps around, and woe to this women laden with sin. Call now, if there be any that will answer thee; and to which of the saints wilt thou turn? For wrath killeth the foolish man ( and woman ) , and envy slayeth the silly one. I have seen the foolish taking root: but suddenly I cursed his habitation. 4 His children are far from safety, and they are crushed in the gate, neither is there any to deliver them.

    God accomplishing his purpose through the wicked, is not a promotion, of those who lack fidelity, who blame others for their lack of commitment, and defraud the one who is sacrificially loyal.
    Acts 2:23 This man was handed over to you by God's set purpose and foreknowledge; with the help of wicked men, Acts 4:28-30 They did what your power and will had decided beforehand should happen

    What a devastating curse to pronounce his birth to be a mistake.
    Mark 14:21 The Son of Man will go just as it is written about him. But woe to that man who betrays the Son of Man! It would be better for him if he had not been born ." In one sense, it turns out that the Son of Man is entering into a way of treachery well-marked by the Scriptures—no surprises here. In another sense, the man who turns him in, turns traitor to the Son of Man—better never to have been born than do this!”
    Christ prophetically grieves of this so called companion in the Psalms 55 Wickedness is in the midst thereof: deceit and guile depart not from her streets. 12 For it was not an enemy that reproached me; then I could have borne it: neither was it he that hated me that did magnify himself against me; then I would have hid myself from him: 13 But it was thou, a man mine equal, my guide, and mine acquaintance. 14 We took sweet counsel together, and walked unto the house of God in company. 15 Let death seize upon them, and let them go down quick into hell: for wickedness is in their dwellings, and among them.

    Betrayal is cursed by Jesus on many levels:
    when you receive the childlike on my account, it’s the same as receiving me.
    “But if you give them a hard time, bullying or taking advantage of their simple trust, you’ll soon wish you hadn’t. You’d be better off dropped in the middle of the lake with a millstone around your neck. Doom to the world for giving these God-believing children a hard time! Hard times are inevitable, but you don’t have to make it worse—and it’s doomsday to you if you do.



    Many say that sin is sin but the sin of betrayal and apostasy is under an extreme curse as being greater then garden variety sin. There are degrees of sin, there are degrees of guilt and there are degrees of condemnation.
    John 19:11 Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin ."

    The principle is that the greater the privilege, the greater the responsibility. For believers, it means that there will be degrees of reward in heaven. For unbelievers, it means that there will be degrees of punishment in hell. Those who have come to know God’s will as it is revealed in the Scriptures are under great responsibility to obey it. Much has been given to them; much will be required of them. Those who have not been so highly privileged will also be punished for their misdeeds, but their punishment will be less severe.


    Luke 12:47-48
    47 "That servant who knows his master's will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows. 48 But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. For everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.


    Sin constantly deceives people so they live in falsehood. But pretentious lifestyles do not dismiss culpability.
    John 9:41 Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains. From another angle: If you were really blind, you would be blameless, but since you claim to see everything so well, you’re accountable for every fault and failure.”


    Having a excuse for blowing it, is a refined science in the lives of those who want to embrace their decadent debauched activities. Some have developed elaborate elocution like garrulous dogs.
    John 15:22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin. Now, however, they have no excuse for their sin.

    Betrayal and disloyalty is a twin genetic flaw to apostasy and tyranny with truth it again lands us in the territory of a tragic woe.
    Heb 6:4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6 if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. 7 Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.

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  65. Yes, God does call it a free gift!

    "But not as the offence, so also is the FREE GIFT....." (Ro 5:15)

    "...but the FREE GIFT is of many offences unto justification." (Ro 5:16)

    "...by the righteousness of one the FREE GIFT came upon all men unto justification of life."

    "For by grace are ye saved through FAITH; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD: NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast." (Eph 2:8,9)

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  66. Ugh! Argument is futility, absurdity. Discussion is desire for truth. I can see no discussion. I back out now.

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  67. Because this has gotten out of hand, starting with the very first hateful name-calling, I have temporarily moderated comments so you have to identify yourselves. Darkness and anonymity brings out the true heart. And these comments have brought out the truth of who everyone really is. But now there it is time to turn on the light.

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  68. is the first derogatory comment smallfart or prostitution

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  69. Suelo amigo y hermano mio, just one more comment, the seventieth.

    I stopped reading more than the opening lines of the comments other than mine and yours, because I couldn't endure the loveless, mad parody of the search for truth that I found there.

    One of my sons called me a coward once, because I would not argue the rightness of a cause to conclusion. He still doesn't understand me. When people accept that argument or debate means that everyone involved must be willing to give in when the Truth is reached, then argue on (of course, in a spirit of hope, meekness and, yes, even love). But when you are arguing a point with someone who thinks or knows that he or she is right, regardless of where the logic of debate leads, then it's time to stop.

    In our public reading of the Word of God, when we are questioned, we stop reading and explain, but we never argue with anyone. If the Word of God is not enough to convince someone, then what can I add that will make a difference.

    Go with God, brother!

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  70. Come on, now, Steve "freespirit".
    Sincerely, Suelo aka Daniel Shellabarger

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  71. Unlike the animals, who seem quite content to simply be themselves, we humans are always looking for ways to be more than or other than what we find ourselves to be. We explore the countryside for excitement, search our souls for meaning, shop the world for pleasure. We try this. Then we try that. The usual fields of endeavor are money, sex, power, adventure, and knowledge.
    Everything we try is so promising at first! But nothing ever seems to amount to very much. We intensify our efforts—but the harder we work at it, the less we get out of it. Some people give up early and settle for a humdrum life. Others never seem to learn, and so they flail away through a lifetime, avoiding who they really are by exploiting everyone elses identity, becoming less and less human by the year, until by the time they die there is hardly enough humanity left to compose a corpse. our senior years are spent putting cardboard puzzels together and crossword schemes salvaging pieces of our worn out soul. But acerbic wit is not something we should hide from, it is stark honesty that compels notice, cool skepticism, a refreshing negation to the lush and seductive suggestions swirling around us, promising everything but delivering nothing, it clears the air. And once the air is cleared, we are ready for reality.

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  72. Well, I have fully read each and every comment posted. And I definitely haven’t said anything hateful or angry. I have a very open mind to everything, you say it from your perspective, and I’ll say it from my perspective. :) And yes I think that if we knew who was talking it might help us have a deeper understanding of there perspective.
    <3 love, Hannah Midkiff

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  73. good job Hannah, it's not the size of the dog in the fight but the size of the fight in the dog. you'll never wimper away when someone challenges you're hold on truth because truth holds on to you and won't let you go. you don't avoid a person or hide from them when they challenge the truth or lack of truth you exhibit. you don't run or turn a deaf ear because the presentation has to be in soft, gentle tones. you show conviction to contend for the truth no matter what the cost, with the ability to sacrifice in the face of glaring rejection. God bless you.

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  74. Thanks for identifying yourself and expressing thoughtfulness, Hannah. As for me, I can't contribute more to this argument, because it is going in circles and has become confusion.

    If any of you care to read my blog entries, or even just re-read my comments right here, without a hard heart, you MIGHT just find that most of the comments here are total misunderstandings of what I am saying, and you will find, without a doubt, most these comments are full of assumptions. Assumptions!

    Since you can't see my expressions, I am not angry.

    And, for family: if you want to discuss family matters, please, let's take it to email, not this blog. For dignity's sake, no Jerry Springer-ness, please! Otherwise, I'll have to stop or delete this comment string.

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  75. "most these comments are full of assumptions. Assumptions!"
    Try lies and hypocrisy.Delete the whole blog...the world would be better for it.

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  76. As there is a future for us, it's an issue ®, I don't know, if I can
    fail to mention to you or myself, if you so want it, a relatively big
    complication, whose solution you are, however, welcome to take up with me, pls., so that I can more
    easily find out, what moral's our
    future as such.
    Greet's, a.respect-
    life70@gmail.com.

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  77. Continued, pls. hereby find & receive 'my' phone, so that I can at least, at long last more easily of course become & believe in, whatever's my fate, pls. & by all means be in on it.
    Greet's, a.respect-
    life70@gmail.com,
    +562 558
    9791.

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  78. This site is so gay the maker of this is a fag

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  79. You're damn right I'm a fag. There's no shame in the light. When you love the dark and loathe the light, you have to be anonymous, & you live in shame & assume others live in shame, too. I dare you, anonymous, to have a little courage and come out of your closet, out of the darkness, into the light. I dare you. Be a man.

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  80. It's strange, the only time I've ever been on "cognitive pharmaceuticals" for seemingly health related issues it caused a reaction that had me in such intense unanchored fear... the green of the fields and the din of the highway and of all of physical reality... all seemed to be evil...perhaps not evil but impinging upon me so incessantly as to be felt as aggressive toward me... and these various things planted all over the surface of the earth came slithering as slow as recognition through the window, floating pendulous in sway, they creeped in toward me. I think this was the first full mind-body reaction I ever had concerning the nature of my own mortality and the terror I felt was the very sensation of self-decay; the "7-headed snake" I experienced was/is the absolutely enveloping experience of existance. The length of the snake is the linear nature of time but always with the same head(s) which can be traced to several traditions be they chakras, 7 virtues &"deadly"sins, the 7 cardinal emotions as described by Five Elements Cycle which is related to Chinese Medicine and anchored in Taoism, and any other 7-based system... these "ways of experience", the 7-of-your-choice, are the small end of the funnel while the singular-tail-length of the snake is the wide end of the funnel, the totality of reality coming together to a simplistic deduction, forcing infinity to be understood within any combination of the 7 notes available to us, all of which will bite us. The human mind can only conceive of these many ways of understanding and relating to the nature of life but it is in knowing that riding atop them is the key to any of the euphemisms for "enlightenment". By recognizing that the world will drive and barrel down upon you and exact any combination of emotional reactions from your body you need learn how to separate yourself from this unending train of (stimulus=response) and sit upon that equal-sign there, all encased by those parentheses.

    The last year or so I've had a number of realizations relating to fantazy/reality, the need for responsibility of those with power, that I can simply be happy, but the one I think was most, well, releveant to what I've written above is how the nature of Eternity/Infinity is devised: Eternity is the instant of Now. The Present Instant of Experience is the "Forever" which is explained in the Bible as the Heaven in which we look with awe into the face of God (Reality). And by clearing away all the unnecessary things that stem from moments past we can have the most important and valuable thing ever which is moment after moment of pure reality to do with what we please. Money/usury, yes, in relation to Eternity, does tie us to a past and steals our future...it is the Naga, condensed-reality-placeholder, rather than experienced-reality. By partaking of money/usury, one becomes another object in the train of objects that makes up the body of the snake, flattening your value to that of mere objects. I'm jsut repeating what you've said in so many entries...

    I've found your lessons I think at a time when I needed reassurance of things I've been learning in this vein. I'll be reading more. Thanks for sharing your ideas as it's of great help to me here in the thick of it.

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  81. Leaving without home and money gives discipline.
    Cutting wishes, rejecting pleasures brings strength.
    Making sacrifices for the others increases love.
    Practicing and hiding virtues from the people adds eternal rewards.

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